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PBS NewsHour (Nov to Dec 2017), Nov 13, 2017 - How does Trump’s Asia trip affect American trade and security?

Nov 13, 2017 - How does Trump's Asia trip affect American trade and security?

Nov 13, 2017 - How does Trump's Asia trip affect American trade and security?.

Judy Woodruff:

President Trump is winding down his 12-day, five-nation trip to Asia by, among other things, meeting with a controversial leader accused of abusing human rights.

On the surface, at least, it was all pleasantries between Mr. Trump and his host, Philippines President Rodrigo Duterte.

Donald Trump:

We have had a great relationship.

This has been very successful.Judy Woodruff:, White House spokeswoman Sarah Sanders said:

Up for discussion, trade and fighting terrorism.

In public at least, President Trump did not mention Duterte's bloody crackdown on drug suspects.Philippines officials estimate more than 3,000 people have died.

Human rights groups say it is three times that many.

Duterte has even boasted of killing men with his own hands when he was younger.

After today's meeting “Human rights briefly came up in the context of the Philippines' fight against illegal drugs.” A spokesman for Duterte denied that Mr. Trump ever raised the issue.

Harry Roque:

Well, there was no mention of human rights, there was no mention of extralegal killings.

There was only a rather lengthy discussion about the Philippines' war on drugs.Judy Woodruff: The leaders ignored reporters' questions. Duterte called them spies, drawing laughter from President Trump.

Reactions were sharply different in the streets.

Hundreds of people protested the Trump visit, and police beat them back with shields and water cannons.

Duterte, though, seemed unfazed.

Last night, he even broke into song for his guest of honor.

Rodrigo Duterte:

Ladies and gentlemen, I sang, uninvited, a duet with Ms.

Pilita Corrales, upon the orders of the commander in chief of the United States.

(LAUGHTER) Judy Woodruff:

Still, there are differences.

Today, Mr. Trump addressed leaders of ASEAN, a bloc of Southeast Asian nations, hoping they will help counter China's influence.

President Duterte is seeking closer ties with China.

At a forum yesterday, he called it the number one economic power.

Rodrigo Duterte:

The South China Sea is better left untouched.

Nobody can afford to go to war.Judy Woodruff:, the president was asked if he pressed Putin on Russia's meddling in the 2016 election.He answered that:

Over the weekend, President Trump drew fire for his embrace of another strongman, Russia's President Vladimir Putin.

They spoke during a summit of Asian-Pacific leaders in Vietnam.

Afterward “Every time he sees me he says, ‘I didn't do that,' and I really believe that when he tells me that.” Mr. Trump also said U.S. intelligence agency leaders who had confirmed Russian meddling were — quote — “political hacks.” But, on Sunday, he said he was talking about previous agency heads. Donald Trump:

I'm with our agencies, especially as currently constituted with their leadership.

I believe in our intel agencies.

Judy Woodruff:

Tomorrow, the president attends an East Asia summit meeting in Manila, concluding his Asia tour.

We take a closer look at the trip and what message Mr. Trump is sending to the region with Richard Haass.

He served in Republican administrations on the National Security Council staff and in the State Department.He is now the president of the Council on Foreign Relations.His latest book is “A World in Disarray.” And Michael Pillsbury is a senior fellow at the Hudson Institute, where he directs the Center for Chinese Strategy.He was also an adviser to the Trump transition.

And welcome to both of you.

Welcome back to the program.

Michael Pillsbury, to you first.

What is the main thing the president has accomplished on this trip?

Michael Pillsbury:

I think there's two or three things.

The main thing is to lay the foundation for his next trip, next year.

He has laid the foundation in each of these five countries.He's taken very seriously the three multilateral organizations that he met with.He's also integrated trade and security in a very unique way that has not been done for a long time.

If you look at his team at some of these meetings, not only has Secretary of State Tillerson — he's also got Bob Lighthizer from USTR.

So it is a unique combination of trade and security put together.It comes out also in some of the bilateral agreements with the five governments.

Judy Woodruff:

Richard Haass, how do you see the accomplishments on the trip so far?

Richard Haass:

Well, the principal accomplishment, in the spirit of Woody Allen, was showing up, the fact that the president of the United States went to five countries, spent nearly two weeks, showed up at all these meetings.

I think that says that Asia is important to us.

This was, however in part undone by his own lack of discipline.You mentioned some of the things in your introduction, the kind treatment of the illiberal, to say the least, president of the Philippines, the statements about Mr. Putin, the trashing of former American intelligence officials.

All this detracted from the trip.

And where I disagree with Michael Pillsbury fundamentally is the president, rather than integrating security and trade, if anything, divorced the two.And historians will say, I will predict, the principal decision of the trip was to further distance the United States from the dynamism in the region, to keep the United States outside the multilateral trade mechanism, and the principal beneficiary of that is China, as our allies and friends are essentially left to their own devices.

Judy Woodruff:

Well, let's take those one at a time, Michael Pillsbury.

Michael Pillsbury:

Sure.

Judy Woodruff:

What about his first, Richard Haass's first point, that the president, with all these comments flattering the strongmen, cozying up to people who have not been seen as friendly to the U.S., that that really hurt the overall effort to get something done?

Michael Pillsbury:

Human rights was mentioned in the bilateral statement between the Philippines and the United States.

So it is a little bit unfair for Richard to say — you know, be as harsh as he is.

This is a first time out.And I completely agree with invoking Woody Allen that 90 percent of life just showing up.

But it's more than that.

He got some agreements.When I mentioned trade and economics being integrated, I'm talking about the businessmen who showed up in Beijing with a promised $250 billion in deals.Businessmen were part of each of the stops.

So it cannot be denied that Trump is trying to integrate trade and investment with security issues.

I think also it's important that he laid out an exit ramp for the leader of North Korea.This is new.

Judy Woodruff:

Well, let me stop you there.

I want to come back to Richard on that point about trade and security, and then we will come back to North Korea.

Richard, what about that?

Richard Haass:

Deals are not the answer.

A lot of these deals in part represented previous agreements that then may take five, 10, 15 years to really come to fruition.

That is going to then make the size of them quite insignificant.

The real economic opportunity was to integrate the United States in the Trans-Pacific Partnership.

It would have set very high standards for the region.China is not a part of it.And it would have forced China to make a decision, stay outside the region economically or join it, but join it on term terms that we want, that they have to open up to investment and trade, that they can't demand certain types of technology transfer, they can't steal technology.

So, we had this mechanism which we helped negotiate, and then Mr. Trump has walked away from it.

Judy Woodruff:

So, did the U.S.

lose ground with regard to China in Asia?

Michael Pillsbury:

No, I don't think so.

I understand Richard Haass' criticism of walking away from TPP.I think what the president has in mind is replacing it in two ways.One is some sort of benefit from TPP.It's not entirely dropped.Some aspects of it can be incorporated in the new framework, which is bilateral agreements with each of these major trading nations. The other thing I need to remind Richard Haass of is an excellent book he once wrote called “Reluctant Sheriff.” It has the concept in that book of a ripeness or ripening, when an issue is ready to be settled.

It is a very important thing in geopolitics to know when it is time to do something.

Right now, it's time to move toward more bilateral trade agreements that are fairer to us.It's also time to talk about North Korea, which he did at every stop, but in a much more measured way than some of the military threats that had been used earlier.

In fact, there was very little discussion of sort of an attack on North Korea during the trip.

I think that is a good thing.

Judy Woodruff:

Richard Haass, what about the North Korea point and then about the trade, whether the timing is right?

Michael Pillsbury:

And about this great book “The Reluctant Sheriff.”

(LAUGHTER)

Richard Haass:

It's impossible to criticize someone who says nice things about something you have written.

(LAUGHTER)

Richard Haass:

But let me come to North Korea.

That's obviously the most urgent national security threat, not just in the region, but the world.

The president, I think, erred by some of his public tweeting and so forth, but, privately, the real question is, over time, did he line up Japan, South Korea and, most important, China to work with us more on putting pressure on North Korea?

And even more, I think the question will be, Judy, is the United States now prepared to introduce an element of diplomacy.

The choices are essentially living with North Korea with a large missile and nuclear inventory.That is not desirable.Going to war with North Korea, also not desirable.

So why not introduce a serious diplomatic dimension?

It won't eliminate the problem, but it could cap and stabilize it and create a baseline.I don't see that yet.I'm hoping.And, again, this is one trip, I realize.It's not an entire foreign policy.We will have to look back on it one day.I'm hoping that that ultimately gets introduced.Judy Woodruff:

Well, we are going to have an opportunity in the future to look back at this.

(LAUGHTER)

Judy Woodruff:

We want to thank both of you, both the promoter of the book and the author himself.

(LAUGHTER)

Judy Woodruff:

Richard Haass, Michael Pillsbury, thank you both.

Michael Pillsbury:

Richard is being too harsh on President Trump.

That is my final view.

(LAUGHTER)

Michael Pillsbury:

Thank you, Judy.

Judy Woodruff:

Thank you.

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Nov 13, 2017 - How does Trump’s Asia trip affect American trade and security?. 13 novembre 2017 - Comment le voyage de Trump en Asie affecte-t-il le commerce et la sécurité américains ?.

Judy Woodruff:

President Trump is winding down his 12-day, five-nation trip to Asia by, among other things, meeting with a controversial leader accused of abusing human rights. Le président Trump termine son voyage de 12 jours dans cinq pays en Asie en rencontrant, entre autres, un dirigeant controversé accusé d'avoir bafoué les droits de l'homme.

On the surface, at least, it was all pleasantries between Mr. Trump and his host, Philippines President Rodrigo Duterte. En apparence, du moins, ce n'étaient que des plaisanteries entre M. Trump et son hôte, le président philippin Rodrigo Duterte.

Donald Trump:

We have had a great relationship.

This has been very successful.Judy Woodruff:, White House spokeswoman Sarah Sanders said:

Up for discussion, trade and fighting terrorism. Place à la discussion, au commerce et à la lutte contre le terrorisme. 进行讨论、贸易和打击恐怖主义。

In public at least, President Trump did not mention Duterte’s bloody crackdown on drug suspects.Philippines officials estimate more than 3,000 people have died. En public du moins, le président Trump n'a pas mentionné la répression sanglante de Duterte contre les suspects de drogue. Les responsables philippins estiment que plus de 3 000 personnes sont mortes.

Human rights groups say it is three times that many.

Duterte has even boasted of killing men with his own hands when he was younger. Duterte s'est même vanté d'avoir tué des hommes de ses propres mains quand il était plus jeune.

After today’s meeting “Human rights briefly came up in the context of the Philippines' fight against illegal drugs.” Après la réunion d'aujourd'hui, « les droits de l'homme ont brièvement été abordés dans le contexte de la lutte des Philippines contre les drogues illicites ». A spokesman for Duterte denied that Mr. Trump ever raised the issue. Un porte-parole de Duterte a nié que M. Trump ait jamais soulevé la question. 杜特尔特的发言人否认特朗普曾提出过这个问题。

Harry Roque:

Well, there was no mention of human rights, there was no mention of extralegal killings. Eh bien, il n'y avait aucune mention des droits de l'homme, il n'y avait aucune mention des meurtres extralégaux.

There was only a rather lengthy discussion about the Philippines' war on drugs.Judy Woodruff: Il n'y a eu qu'une discussion assez longue sur la guerre des Philippines contre la drogue. Judy Woodruff : The leaders ignored reporters' questions. Duterte called them spies, drawing laughter from President Trump. Duterte les a qualifiés d'espions, faisant rire le président Trump.

Reactions were sharply different in the streets.

Hundreds of people protested the Trump visit, and police beat them back with shields and water cannons. Des centaines de personnes ont protesté contre la visite de Trump et la police les a repoussées avec des boucliers et des canons à eau.

Duterte, though, seemed unfazed. 不过,杜特尔特似乎并不担心。

Last night, he even broke into song for his guest of honor. Hier soir, il s'est même mis à chanter pour son invité d'honneur.

Rodrigo Duterte:

Ladies and gentlemen, I sang, uninvited, a duet with Ms. Mesdames et messieurs, j'ai chanté, sans y être invité, un duo avec Ms.

Pilita Corrales, upon the orders of the commander in chief of the United States.

(LAUGHTER) Judy Woodruff:

Still, there are differences.

Today, Mr. Trump addressed leaders of ASEAN, a bloc of Southeast Asian nations, hoping they will help counter China’s influence. Aujourd'hui, M. Trump s'est adressé aux dirigeants de l'ASEAN, un bloc de nations d'Asie du Sud-Est, dans l'espoir qu'ils aideront à contrer l'influence de la Chine.

President Duterte is seeking closer ties with China.

At a forum yesterday, he called it the number one economic power.

Rodrigo Duterte:

The South China Sea is better left untouched. Il vaut mieux ne pas toucher à la mer de Chine méridionale.

Nobody can afford to go to war.Judy Woodruff:, the president was asked if he pressed Putin on Russia’s meddling in the 2016 election.He answered that: Personne ne peut se permettre d'aller à la guerre. Judy Woodruff :, on a demandé au président s'il pressait Poutine sur l'ingérence de la Russie dans les élections de 2016. Il a répondu que :

Over the weekend, President Trump drew fire for his embrace of another strongman, Russia’s President Vladimir Putin. Au cours du week-end, le président Trump a attiré l'attention sur son étreinte d'un autre homme fort, le président russe Vladimir Poutine.

They spoke during a summit of Asian-Pacific leaders in Vietnam.

Afterward “Every time he sees me he says, ‘I didn’t do that,' and I really believe that when he tells me that.” Mr. Trump also said U.S. intelligence agency leaders who had confirmed Russian meddling were — quote — “political hacks.” But, on Sunday, he said he was talking about previous agency heads. les dirigeants des agences de renseignement qui avaient confirmé l'ingérence russe étaient - je cite - des « hacks politiques ». Mais, dimanche, il a dit qu'il parlait des anciens chefs d'agence. 证实俄罗斯干预的情报机构领导人是“政治黑客”。但是,周日,他表示他正在谈论前任机构负责人。 Donald Trump:

I’m with our agencies, especially as currently constituted with their leadership. Je suis avec nos agences, surtout telles qu'elles sont actuellement constituées avec leur leadership.

I believe in our intel agencies.

Judy Woodruff:

Tomorrow, the president attends an East Asia summit meeting in Manila, concluding his Asia tour.

We take a closer look at the trip and what message Mr. Trump is sending to the region with Richard Haass.

He served in Republican administrations on the National Security Council staff and in the State Department.He is now the president of the Council on Foreign Relations.His latest book is “A World in Disarray.” And Michael Pillsbury is a senior fellow at the Hudson Institute, where he directs the Center for Chinese Strategy.He was also an adviser to the Trump transition. Il a servi dans les administrations républicaines au sein du personnel du Conseil de sécurité nationale et du département d'État. Il est maintenant président du Council on Foreign Relations. Son dernier livre est "A World in Disarray". Et Michael Pillsbury est chercheur principal à l'Institut Hudson, où il dirige le Center for Chinese Strategy. Il a également été conseiller lors de la transition Trump.

And welcome to both of you.

Welcome back to the program.

Michael Pillsbury, to you first.

What is the main thing the president has accomplished on this trip? 总统此行主要完成了哪些事情?

Michael Pillsbury:

I think there’s two or three things.

The main thing is to lay the foundation for his next trip, next year. L'essentiel est de jeter les bases de son prochain voyage, l'année prochaine.

He has laid the foundation in each of these five countries.He’s taken very seriously the three multilateral organizations that he met with.He’s also integrated trade and security in a very unique way that has not been done for a long time.

If you look at his team at some of these meetings, not only has Secretary of State Tillerson — he’s also got Bob Lighthizer from USTR. Si vous regardez son équipe lors de certaines de ces réunions, non seulement le secrétaire d'État Tillerson, mais aussi Bob Lighthizer de l'USTR.

So it is a unique combination of trade and security put together.It comes out also in some of the bilateral agreements with the five governments. Il s'agit donc d'une combinaison unique de commerce et de sécurité. Cela ressort également de certains des accords bilatéraux avec les cinq gouvernements.

Judy Woodruff:

Richard Haass, how do you see the accomplishments on the trip so far?

Richard Haass:

Well, the principal accomplishment, in the spirit of Woody Allen, was showing up, the fact that the president of the United States went to five countries, spent nearly two weeks, showed up at all these meetings. Eh bien, la principale réalisation, dans l'esprit de Woody Allen, a été de se présenter, le fait que le président des États-Unis se soit rendu dans cinq pays, ait passé près de deux semaines, se soit présenté à toutes ces réunions.

I think that says that Asia is important to us.

This was, however in part undone by his own lack of discipline.You mentioned some of the things in your introduction, the kind treatment of the illiberal, to say the least, president of the Philippines, the statements about Mr. Putin, the trashing of former American intelligence officials. Cependant, cela a été en partie annulé par son propre manque de discipline. Vous avez mentionné certaines des choses dans votre introduction, le traitement bienveillant de l'illibéral, pour dire le moins, le président des Philippines, les déclarations sur M. Poutine, les attaques d'anciens responsables du renseignement américain.

All this detracted from the trip. Tout cela a nui au voyage.

And where I disagree with Michael Pillsbury fundamentally is the president, rather than integrating security and trade, if anything, divorced the two.And historians will say, I will predict, the principal decision of the trip was to further distance the United States from the dynamism in the region, to keep the United States outside the multilateral trade mechanism, and the principal beneficiary of that is China, as our allies and friends are essentially left to their own devices. Et là où je suis fondamentalement en désaccord avec Michael Pillsbury, c'est le président, plutôt que d'intégrer la sécurité et le commerce, le cas échéant, a divorcé les deux. Et les historiens diront, je prédis, la principale décision du voyage était d'éloigner davantage les États-Unis dynamisme dans la région, pour maintenir les États-Unis en dehors du mécanisme commercial multilatéral, et le principal bénéficiaire en est la Chine, car nos alliés et amis sont essentiellement livrés à eux-mêmes.

Judy Woodruff:

Well, let’s take those one at a time, Michael Pillsbury. Eh bien, prenons-les une à la fois, Michael Pillsbury.

Michael Pillsbury:

Sure.

Judy Woodruff:

What about his first, Richard Haass’s first point, that the president, with all these comments flattering the strongmen, cozying up to people who have not been seen as friendly to the U.S., that that really hurt the overall effort to get something done? Qu'en est-il de son premier, le premier point de Richard Haass, que le président, avec tous ces commentaires flattant les hommes forts, se rapprochant de personnes qui n'ont pas été considérées comme amicales avec les États-Unis, que cela a vraiment nui à l'effort global pour faire quelque chose ?

Michael Pillsbury:

Human rights was mentioned in the bilateral statement between the Philippines and the United States.

So it is a little bit unfair for Richard to say — you know, be as harsh as he is. Il est donc un peu injuste pour Richard de dire – vous savez, soyez aussi dur que lui.

This is a first time out.And I completely agree with invoking Woody Allen that 90 percent of life just showing up. C'est une première fois. Et je suis tout à fait d'accord avec l'invocation de Woody Allen selon laquelle 90 % de la vie vient d'apparaître.

But it’s more than that.

He got some agreements.When I mentioned trade and economics being integrated, I’m talking about the businessmen who showed up in Beijing with a promised $250 billion in deals.Businessmen were part of each of the stops. Il a obtenu des accords. Lorsque j'ai mentionné l'intégration du commerce et de l'économie, je parle des hommes d'affaires qui se sont présentés à Pékin avec une promesse de 250 milliards de dollars de transactions. Les hommes d'affaires faisaient partie de chacune des étapes.

So it cannot be denied that Trump is trying to integrate trade and investment with security issues.

I think also it’s important that he laid out an exit ramp for the leader of North Korea.This is new. Je pense aussi qu'il est important qu'il ait tracé une bretelle de sortie pour le leader de la Corée du Nord. C'est nouveau.

Judy Woodruff:

Well, let me stop you there.

I want to come back to Richard on that point about trade and security, and then we will come back to North Korea.

Richard, what about that?

Richard Haass:

Deals are not the answer.

A lot of these deals in part represented previous agreements that then may take five, 10, 15 years to really come to fruition. Bon nombre de ces accords représentaient en partie des accords antérieurs qui pourraient prendre cinq, 10 ou 15 ans pour se concrétiser.

That is going to then make the size of them quite insignificant. Cela va alors rendre leur taille assez insignifiante.

The real economic opportunity was to integrate the United States in the Trans-Pacific Partnership.

It would have set very high standards for the region.China is not a part of it.And it would have forced China to make a decision, stay outside the region economically or join it, but join it on term terms that we want, that they have to open up to investment and trade, that they can’t demand certain types of technology transfer, they can’t steal technology. Cela aurait fixé des normes très élevées pour la région. La Chine n'en fait pas partie. Et cela aurait forcé la Chine à prendre une décision, rester en dehors de la région économiquement ou la rejoindre, mais la rejoindre à des conditions que nous voulons, qui qu'ils doivent s'ouvrir aux investissements et au commerce, qu'ils ne peuvent pas exiger certains types de transfert de technologie, qu'ils ne peuvent pas voler la technologie.

So, we had this mechanism which we helped negotiate, and then Mr. Trump has walked away from it. Donc, nous avions ce mécanisme que nous avons aidé à négocier, puis M. Trump s'en est éloigné.

Judy Woodruff:

So, did the U.S.

lose ground with regard to China in Asia?

Michael Pillsbury:

No, I don’t think so.

I understand Richard Haass' criticism of walking away from TPP.I think what the president has in mind is replacing it in two ways.One is some sort of benefit from TPP.It’s not entirely dropped.Some aspects of it can be incorporated in the new framework, which is bilateral agreements with each of these major trading nations. Je comprends la critique de Richard Haass de s'éloigner du TPP. Je pense que ce que le président a à l'esprit est de le remplacer de deux manières. L'une est une sorte d'avantage du TPP. Il n'est pas entièrement abandonné. nouveau cadre, c'est-à-dire des accords bilatéraux avec chacune de ces grandes nations commerçantes. The other thing I need to remind Richard Haass of is an excellent book he once wrote called “Reluctant Sheriff.” It has the concept in that book of a ripeness or ripening, when an issue is ready to be settled. L'autre chose que je dois rappeler à Richard Haass est un excellent livre qu'il a écrit une fois intitulé "Reluctant Sheriff". Il a le concept dans ce livre d'une maturité ou d'une maturation, quand une question est prête à être réglée.

It is a very important thing in geopolitics to know when it is time to do something.

Right now, it’s time to move toward more bilateral trade agreements that are fairer to us.It’s also time to talk about North Korea, which he did at every stop, but in a much more measured way than some of the military threats that had been used earlier. À l'heure actuelle, il est temps d'aller vers davantage d'accords commerciaux bilatéraux plus équitables pour nous. Il est également temps de parler de la Corée du Nord, ce qu'il a fait à chaque étape, mais de manière beaucoup plus mesurée que certaines des menaces militaires qui avaient été utilisé plus tôt.

In fact, there was very little discussion of sort of an attack on North Korea during the trip. En fait, il y a eu très peu de discussions sur une sorte d'attaque contre la Corée du Nord pendant le voyage.

I think that is a good thing.

Judy Woodruff:

Richard Haass, what about the North Korea point and then about the trade, whether the timing is right? Richard Haass, qu'en est-il du point de la Corée du Nord et ensuite du commerce, si le moment est bien choisi ?

Michael Pillsbury:

And about this great book “The Reluctant Sheriff.”

(LAUGHTER)

Richard Haass:

It’s impossible to criticize someone who says nice things about something you have written.

(LAUGHTER)

Richard Haass:

But let me come to North Korea.

That’s obviously the most urgent national security threat, not just in the region, but the world.

The president, I think, erred by some of his public tweeting and so forth, but, privately, the real question is, over time, did he line up Japan, South Korea and, most important, China to work with us more on putting pressure on North Korea? Le président, je pense, s'est trompé avec certains de ses tweets publics, etc., mais, en privé, la vraie question est, au fil du temps, a-t-il aligné le Japon, la Corée du Sud et, le plus important, la Chine pour travailler davantage avec nous sur la mise pression sur la Corée du Nord ?

And even more, I think the question will be, Judy, is the United States now prepared to introduce an element of diplomacy.

The choices are essentially living with North Korea with a large missile and nuclear inventory.That is not desirable.Going to war with North Korea, also not desirable. Les choix sont essentiellement de vivre avec la Corée du Nord avec un large inventaire de missiles et de missiles nucléaires. Ce n'est pas souhaitable. Entrer en guerre avec la Corée du Nord, n'est pas non plus souhaitable.

So why not introduce a serious diplomatic dimension?

It won’t eliminate the problem, but it could cap and stabilize it and create a baseline.I don’t see that yet.I’m hoping.And, again, this is one trip, I realize.It’s not an entire foreign policy.We will have to look back on it one day.I’m hoping that that ultimately gets introduced.Judy Woodruff: Cela n'éliminera pas le problème, mais cela pourrait le plafonner et le stabiliser et créer une ligne de base. Je ne vois pas encore cela. J'espère. Et, encore une fois, c'est un voyage, je me rends compte. politique. Nous devrons y revenir un jour. J'espère que cela finira par être introduit. Judy Woodruff :

Well, we are going to have an opportunity in the future to look back at this. Eh bien, nous aurons l'occasion à l'avenir de revenir sur cela.

(LAUGHTER)

Judy Woodruff:

We want to thank both of you, both the promoter of the book and the author himself.

(LAUGHTER)

Judy Woodruff:

Richard Haass, Michael Pillsbury, thank you both.

Michael Pillsbury:

Richard is being too harsh on President Trump. Richard est trop dur avec le président Trump.

That is my final view.

(LAUGHTER)

Michael Pillsbury:

Thank you, Judy.

Judy Woodruff:

Thank you.