I hear a lot of people say it’s not the reason they learn a language etc. etc.
But there are just many things that are unknown by hobbists. For instance in the Netherlands we have this thing “public transit card” that the government calls OV-chipkaart but we call OV or OV kaart. Even if someone would say OV pasje we would not think weirdly of it.
I think what a lot of people would dislike about CEFR exams is that they would enforce the usage of the government. Or ask about things they never needed to know like the High School system in the Netherlands. We have around 5 - 7 levels ending around 16 - 18 year olds with the chance of going up a level or down. Yes, some people finish high school at 16 and other people are still at it when their 19. The ones that finish at 16 because of doing a lower level will not be allowed to go to college. (Colleges will not accept them).
Anyway this is just an example of something I think an instructor that is preparing you for the CEFR will explain, but by reading newspapers and books a student will never learn. Again this was merely an example. My thought is that a lot of things are getting skipped. That I think are quite the enjoyable things to know.
Also I think having a B2 certificate is quite the accomplishment. Eventhough some say they are also B2, but just think its a waste of money to get a certificate. I just don’t get that you’ve put years of studying into a language and never did an example test or want to know if you are really B2.
Whats your thoughts?
2 Likes
I have always liked the CEFR system and if certain things go the way I plan, I’m going to take a B2 exam in at least Spanish, French and German. If I remember correctly one common criticism is that they test you on a lots of random stuff and so potentially you could pass the exam one day but that’s under perfect circumstances and jaddijadda.
Well, sure since lots of people take these test you can personalize the test to each and every individual but I’d still say that I’m sure if you have passed a B2 exam and interact with the language regularly you’d be more or less fluent. Of course, it also depends how long it’s been since the exam was passed.
If someone has passed a German B2 exam ten years ago then it would be perfectly valid to be a bit skeptical if he/she is still at a B2 level today. But, then again if the person has been active with the language over the course of those years then it’s perfectly reasonable to assume he/she is still fluent. Ultimately, whether a certificate is worth it or not is a personal choice, I’d like take a few of them sort of to validate that I really do speak some languages to a really high level.
Technically, the CEFR is a good thing, I just wish people were legally barred from referring to CEFR levels, unless they have actually taken an exam. The discussions over various forums – and the inevitable copy and paste of Wikipedia articles to define the levels just drives me nuts.
People claiming to be a “B2” without taking any exams is annoying, BUT, the worst offenders are the people making the claim that a person with a B2 certificate is not really at a B2 level because they somehow don’t conform to the some guys interpretation of a Wikipedia description – copied and pasted, of course.
The CEFR is great for testing and to provide official results for educational or professional purposes. It’s not great for wannabe polyglots self labeling their own skills and those of others.
If someone wants to be called a B2, they should take an exam, otherwise, they’re just an intermediate student without a label, and that should be goon enough.
1 Like
I totally disagree with you. Well, I must admit that the CEFR is great for testing your grammar, writing and perhaps passive vocabulary. When it comes to listening and speaking though, I met oh-so-many certificate holders who were simply unable to pick up a phone at work and call a native speaker! And unfortunately I mean here not only B2, but also C1 level.
On top of that, someone claiming to have a certain CEFR level may be right or wrong, that is true. Still, a certificate holder is exactly in the same situation, because certificates test skills only at a given time. After a year it is already a big unknown.
I have a certificate in Russian from 2007. It has no reference to my skills as of today. I would rather take a look at the descriptions and evaluate my current knowledge.
2 Likes
I know my wording was probably too harsh, but I just feel like in the absence of any certification, self assessing can be a very tricky thing.
For example, I know I can read and listen at a C2 level in German, but I probably don’t speak at that level and I certainly can’t write anywhere above a B1. So what does that make me when someone asks what my level is? The answer I use is that I’m “Comfortable in German.” I’m needer B1, nor C2, I’m just comfortable with daily use of the language.
And most of us are on this sliding scale between comprehension and speaking, writing etc. so putting a CEFR label on where you are is really tricky without taking an actual test.