In the text, we have these two sentences:
紅茶やコーヒーと言った洋食の朝食で育ちました
朝はお米とお味噌汁という和食派な人です
I understand いう to be the same as 言う. What I don’t understand is why is it that the past tense 言った is used in the first sentence (と言った洋食) but not in the second one (という和食派). Or it doesn’t really matter whether one uses 言った or いう in either sentence?
Cantotangoさん
わたしの理解では。。。
紅茶やコーヒーと言った洋食の朝食で育ちました
I grew up in the family which had the western style breakfast, such as tea or coffee.
朝はお米とお味噌汁という和食派な人です
My husband prefers having the Japanese style breakfast, such as rice and miso-shiru
「という・といった」＝such as,
「という・といった」is different from 「言う」
「言う」is used as a verb, but 「という・といった」isn’t used as a verb, but used as a (may be) phrase.
It would be very difficult for non-native to tell one from the other.
But you could tell naturally the difference between the two after you read many sentences.
Emmaさん
間違っていたらごめんなさいね。
Cherryさん
Thanks for the quick reply!
So 言う is different from という. But in the sentence 紅茶やコーヒーと言った洋食の朝食で育ちました, と言った is rather than といった is used. Is this a mistake then???
Cantotangoさん、Cherryさん
早速、最初の文の「紅茶やコーヒーと言った」の「言った」を「いった」に修正しました！
ありがとうございました。
辞書で調べたところ、「such as」の意味で「という、といった」を使う場合は、ひらがなで書くのが一般的だということです。
Emmaさん
Thanks for the clarification!
It may be wrong, and not helpful to anyone but me, but anyway: I have always thought of という or といった as a way of saying “so called” without the negative connotations the phrase has in English. In that sense it is easy to see the いう as 言う in hiragana form.
As for the difference between the 2 forms. I am speculating, but I feel the present tense form connotes that the claim is obvious to everyone, in this case used for the class of Japanese breakfast foods, whereas the past is more tentative in tone, used for Western breakfast items. Either way, both could be technically correct in most cases, at least as far as my instinct tells me.
doooさん
こんにちは！
As you mentioned 「という・といった」can be translated as “so called”. But I knew (very recently!) that this phrase has some negative connotations, which made me avoid using this phrase to explain 「という・といった」.
However, it is obvious that 「という・といった」is deprived from 「言う」. I mean the origin ofという・といったand 言うshould be the same. Thus, your thought really makes sense!
I would be very sorry if you do not understand what I said in this post because of my poor English.
doooさん
As for the difference between the 2 forms
I have never thought about the difference between the past tense and present tense of this phrase, nor have I used them correctly in my life!
You are such a great speaker of Japanese!
dooo,
Since Cherryさん as a native speaker doesn’t have any objection to your speculations, I’ll accept them as indeed true as well!